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Notary007
60 Posts |
 Posted - 08/07/2011 : 2:16:40 PM
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Several points to consider, this is not legal advice:
No translation of the document is required. The notary needs only a few key sentences or phrases to communicate with the signer. These sentences and phrases could be placed on a cheat sheet showing the sentence in English and in the foreign language. Much like a phrase book a tourist or soldier would use in a foreign country. Just point to the sentence you are trying to communicate. The translation is free using Google Translate. No human translator is needed.
Legally competent is a fact, not an opinion. Legally competent would be someone of legal age and no court has ruled them as incompetent to handle their own affairs. Someone with a low IQ might also be considered as legally incompetent. The minimum IQ threshold varies from state to state.
Mental competence would have to be determined by a mental health professional, not a notary. There are tests they can perform to determine a level of mental capacity. There are varying degrees of mental capacity. The person may be capable of understanding a simple one page document, but not a complex ten-page document.
They may have contractual capacity or testamentary capacity. Mental capacity may be high in one area and low in other areas. Remember the movie Rainman? Remember your SAT scores or your grades in school?
Answering closed-ended Yes or No questions does not require as much mental capacity as answering questions that require thought, reasoning, calculation and decision-making ability.
#2 Please write your name on this paper. When they write their name, you can check it against their ID. If it is a match, you are communicating with them and they are demonstrating their cognitive awareness.
#4 Please write the document title on this paper. When they write the document title, you can check it against the document. If it is a match, you are communicating with them and they are demonstrating their cognitive awareness.
For a POA, the principal is appointing an agent. Often the agent must also sign to accept the POA. Sometimes witnesses are also required. If an agent or witness is present, the notary may also question the agent or witness to gain further information and to look for any signs of fraud in the transaction.
If the signer drove to the notary appointment, this indicates the signer has sufficient mental capacity to navigate thru traffic to reach a destination at an appointed time. If the signer has a driver's license, the signer had sufficient mental capacity to pass the driver's license exam.
If the signer is employed, he/she has sufficient mental capacity to hold a job. If they are in a licensed occupation, you can verify their license status on a regulatory website.
If they seem to be friendly, you might ask a few conversational questions, such as what is your favorite Bulgarian food or restaurant? |
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LindaH
Florida
1754 Posts |
Posted - 08/07/2011 : 05:08:53 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Notary007
You can create a Notary "cheat sheet" for over 50 languages, including Bulgarian, by pasting the list of sentences below into http://translate.google.com and translating them online. Then point to the sentence number you want to communicate.
There is also a free Google Translate app for Android. They are working on a conversational mode translator app for Spanish.
If you meet in front of a computer or use a smartphone with Google Translate, you can type in English and it will translate into Bulgarian.
Notary Cheat Sheet
1. Hello. My name is Ken. I am a Notary. I don't speak your language.
2. What is your name? Please write your name on this paper.
3. May I please see your identification? Thank you.
4. What type of document is this? Please write the document title on this paper.
5. Have you read this document?
6. Do you understand the purpose of this document?
7. Are you signing this document voluntarily?
8. Are you legally competent to sign this document?
9. Do you acknowledge that this is your signature?
10. Do you swear or affirm that the statements you have made are true and correct, to the best of your knowledge and belief?
11. Please sign your name here.
12. My fee is ten dollars.
Some Useful Phrases
Yes
No
I do not understand.
I do not know.
Thank you.
Here is my business card.
Have a nice day.
Good bye.
or
Here is the name and phone number of a notary that speaks your language.
Check your state laws and rules regarding using translation software to communicate with a customer.
My .02 FWIW
In FL we can use a translator to translate the document into a language the signer understands and note the translation and translator in our cert and our journal.
I actually really like this "cheat sheet", but IMO I would eliminate #8 - when I determine competency to sign, the last thing I'd rely on is asking the signer if he's competent - of course, he's going to say "yes"! Competency determination, when required, goes far beyond one question and involves more extensive verbal communication. I also would not use a translator for competency questioning..why? Because I have no idea what that translator is saying or what the responder's answers really are!
Just my thoughts..
Linda
http://www.notary.net/websites/LindaHubbell
http://www.columbiacountynotary.webs.com |
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Notary007
60 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2011 : 9:58:25 PM
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You can create a Notary "cheat sheet" for over 50 languages, including Bulgarian, by pasting the list of sentences below into http://translate.google.com and translating them online. Then point to the sentence number you want to communicate.
There is also a free Google Translate app for Android. They are working on a conversational mode translator app for Spanish.
If you meet in front of a computer or use a smartphone with Google Translate, you can type in English and it will translate into Bulgarian.
Notary Cheat Sheet
1. Hello. My name is Ken. I am a Notary. I don't speak your language.
2. What is your name? Please write your name on this paper.
3. May I please see your identification? Thank you.
4. What type of document is this? Please write the document title on this paper.
5. Have you read this document?
6. Do you understand the purpose of this document?
7. Are you signing this document voluntarily?
8. Are you legally competent to sign this document?
9. Do you acknowledge that this is your signature?
10. Do you swear or affirm that the statements you have made are true and correct, to the best of your knowledge and belief?
11. Please sign your name here.
12. My fee is ten dollars.
Some Useful Phrases
Yes
No
I do not understand.
I do not know.
Thank you.
Here is my business card.
Have a nice day.
Good bye.
or
Here is the name and phone number of a notary that speaks your language.
Check your state laws and rules regarding using translation software to communicate with a customer. |
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DianaNotary
California
171 Posts |
Posted - 03/09/2011 : 4:01:58 PM
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to Ken:
the automatic translation is not reliable and some vital information could be lost in translation. (At least the interpreter and the automatic translation is not permitted in California).
I wouldn’t risk and notarize for someone with whom I wasn’t able to communicate for the purpose of notarization. To be safe, I would rather refer the client to someone that speaks the language and could communicate with the signer.
http://www.DianaNotary.com |
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Lisa T.
California
391 Posts |
Posted - 03/04/2011 : 5:51:57 PM
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I agree with LindaH. I believe communication has to be more than just asking a question and getting a yes/no response. The customer must be able to answer an open ended question - to me, that shows he/she and the Notary are communicating. And because the document in question is a POA, I would absolutely refer the customer to a Bulgarian speaking Notary.
I was hired to meet with a Burmese speaking customer. There is no Burmese speaking Notary to be found in Southern Cali - believe me I tried. I explained to the hiring party that CA Notaries cannot use interpreters, I couldn't refer a Burmese speaking Notary and would the client be willing to allow two impartial witnesses in lieu of a Notary. The hiring party contacted their client and they agreed. A friend who is a Notary went with me to the appointment and we signed in the capacity of two witnesses - just like with Wills.
Because I was not wearing my Notary hat, this allowed for the borrower's daughter to translate. The borrower only spoke enough English for a greeting. Anything beyond that, the daughter had to translate. In my case, the document was not a POA.
I would decline to notarize a POA for a non-communicative customer who could not respond to me beyond yes/no. My vote is NO.
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edelske
New York
815 Posts |
Posted - 03/02/2011 : 2:20:06 PM
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This is Great, one vote for one against - anyone casting some tie breakers?
Not loan docs. As stated it was a POA. BTW: my notary oath is a bit lengthy:
Do you acknowledge that these/this is/are your signature/s; that you understood and willfully signed this/these document/s and that the statements are true and accurate to the best of your knowledge and belief?
TRY THAT WITH BULGARIAN PHONETICS !!
Kenneth A Edelstein
Mobile Notary, Apostille / Legalization Processing & Fingerprinting
http://www.kenneth-a-edelstein.com |
Edited by - edelske on 03/03/2011 05:06:22 AM |
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Lee-AR
Arkansas
678 Posts |
Posted - 03/02/2011 : 1:57:26 PM
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This is just a hipshot~~ I'm not talking Loan docs here, OK?
IF the signer has possession of the document and is actively seeking a notarization, I'd say that's 'evidence' that s/he understands it, wants to sign it, knows what it's about--just needs it notarized. Ken's solution sounds like it would fly because we do NOT need to know diddley about the document, just ID & notarize. I'm sure that various states have various opinions...your state laws trump all.
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LindaH
Florida
1754 Posts |
Posted - 03/02/2011 : 08:07:15 AM
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It goes beyond your oath - you need to be able to determine if he (a) understands what he's signing; (b) is mentally competent to sign; (c) is signing of his own volition; etc etc
In english that's relatively easy to determine...in a foreign language with limited common ground that can be tough. FOr all you know his english may be limited to "yes" and "no"..You have no ability to question him and be assured you are getting the answers you need.
I'd pass and refer them to a like-speaking notary or immigration official for further referral ...but that's just me.
Linda
www.notarydepot.com/notary/lindah
http://www.notary.net/websites/LindaHubbell |
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edelske
New York
815 Posts |
Posted - 03/02/2011 : 07:44:25 AM
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The document is in Bulgarian, not a problem as I will be using a loose ack. However, the signer of the POA speaks VERY limited English; and I speak not a word of Bulgarian.
New York state does not require the notary to be able to read the document.
A translator is NOT permitted in New York - direct communication between the notary and the signer is required.
How about this:
I take my standard notary oath and use the internet to translate it into Bulgarian which the client can read. I bring a printed copy. I also have a phonetic version that I can read out loud and the client can understand.
The client knows enough English to respond "Yes".
My question to the gang: does this sound "kosher"?
Kenneth A Edelstein
Mobile Notary, Apostille / Legalization Processing & Fingerprinting
http://www.kenneth-a-edelstein.com |
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No common language - a solution to oath?
